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Author Topic: Empires Of Dust  (Read 14532 times)
folderol
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« on: August 17, 2008, 08:04:36 PM »

This is the final, polished version of Oren's and my collaboration.

I had hoped to put both mp3 and ogg versions here, but the upload limit seems to be for the combined files not individual ones Sad

* Empires_Of_Dust.mp3 (4724.13 KB - downloaded 239 times.)
« Last Edit: August 17, 2008, 08:13:53 PM by folderol » Logged

If you have a poem, I have a tune, and we exchange these, we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song.
- Will
Wyatt
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« Reply #1 on: August 18, 2008, 12:30:07 AM »

This has so much emotional impact..stunning.

Cool

Wyatt
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elwoodblues1969
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« Reply #2 on: August 18, 2008, 01:00:37 AM »

Will & Oren,

The marriage between the chord progressions & guitar riffs are a beautiful union...reminiscent of tunes such as "Wicked Game" from Chris Isaak and "Big Log" from Robert Plant
However though,I was'nt expecting drums to come in,as they just seemed to drop in unannounced and the drum patterns just did not seem to fit the style-as I think the drums have too much of a hard rock feel.
I think the drums would fair better if you double up on the high hat and have a softer,cocktail lounge-type country bass/snare pattern going.

Actually,this song would be great just as an ambient piece-without drums,as I think it would stand strong without any percussion whatsoever.

A very pretty song though..I really enjoyed this one. Cool

Thom
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Oren
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« Reply #3 on: August 18, 2008, 04:55:38 PM »

...this song would be great just as an ambient piece-without drums,as I think it would stand strong without any percussion whatsoever...

Wyatt - thanks! Will's synth track struck an emotional chord for me the very first time I heard it.

Thom - I agree with you about the superfluous nature of the percussion track. It's an interesting exercise in resurrecting John Bonham for one
              more stirring performance, but it really does not serve the song.
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Wyatt
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« Reply #4 on: August 18, 2008, 06:01:02 PM »

I am rather fond of the drum track, myself.

If the song were shorter, it might do fine without it..

..but as it stands, rather than hitting cruising altitude @ 1:10 or so,
the drum track comes in smoothly and gives it lift..the drama continues
to build.

For a five minute song it is a real plus, and prevents it from becoming too
long for itself.

Cool

Wyatt
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kara
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« Reply #5 on: August 18, 2008, 06:16:33 PM »

I'm in the camp of 'against' that drum track, IMO it isn't up to par with the emotional contest of this song  Shocked
To have a drum track that fits that's style of music, you'll need Nick Mason  Wink

But what a great song  wOO
 
k
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offthewall
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« Reply #6 on: August 18, 2008, 09:44:27 PM »

This is an interesting debate.
When Will first posted this tune I decided to have a try at adding something to it. I ran through it dozens of times with different instrumentation and eventually gave up as I couldn't get to grips with the *timing*.
To me the addition of the drum track gives a whole new life to the piece. I love it! Maybe those who don't like the drums should have a go at reworking it from the original. That may bring the appreciation.

 Wink
James
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folderol
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« Reply #7 on: August 18, 2008, 10:07:09 PM »

I'm actually very surprised by all this Shocked

As I think everyone knows by now, percussion is a major bogeyman for me. Nevertheless I think Oren did a good job here. I don't know whether or not it could be better, but I am fairly sure the tune would be poorer without it.

Having said that, I think it is the guitar that changes an interesting chord progression into a real statement.
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If you have a poem, I have a tune, and we exchange these, we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song.
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« Reply #8 on: August 19, 2008, 05:46:45 AM »

Wooow
I was listening this one from poor laptop-speakers and I switched to headphones and now I'm sure you did a pretty good job on it.
The keyboard layering kind of sound with that clean guitar are recalling me of the Led Zep's 'In through the out door' sound and feel
It goes on very well like a natural evolution and it's really enjoyable from our musicians' point of view as well as for the casual listener...
Well done

Cheers
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Oren
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« Reply #9 on: August 19, 2008, 07:41:50 AM »

Wyatt - I'm fond of the drum track, too Cheesy, and it does provide added interest....

Kara - a talented percussionist could lay down a drum track that complemented the existing timing - as it
         is, some of the hits are way off the beat, giving it a "mechanical" flavor.

James - the drums are a nice touch, and Hydrogen does as good a job as any percussion program, but... is
           this bit of programming up to the standards of the other instruments?

Will - how about I mix one without the drums, and we go with two versions? ............really Grin

L.R. - pretty cool, eh?  Roll Eyes Wink


« Last Edit: August 19, 2008, 06:27:52 PM by Oren » Logged

folderol
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« Reply #10 on: August 19, 2008, 08:30:55 PM »

Will - how about I mix one without the drums, and we go with two versions? ............really Grin
If that's what people want, I'd be quite happy about the idea. Indeed I'd be happy about any other ideas people have for this track.
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If you have a poem, I have a tune, and we exchange these, we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song.
- Will
Wyatt
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« Reply #11 on: August 21, 2008, 01:04:59 PM »

Will - how about I mix one without the drums, and we go with two versions? ............really Grin
If that's what people want, I'd be quite happy about the idea. Indeed I'd be happy about any other ideas people have for this track.

I don't know if it is actually going to happen or not, but I suspect that two entirely different perspectives might very well turn out to be two very beautiful songs, each in their own way.

Cool

Wyatt
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Oren
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« Reply #12 on: September 14, 2008, 08:01:01 AM »

I don't know if it is actually going to happen or not, but I suspect that two entirely different perspectives might very well turn out to be two very beautiful songs, each in their own way.

Taking into consideration the constructive criticism offered in this thread (as we would all be wise to do...  Wink), I've nearly finished two new versions of "Empires of Dust".

No percussion version:
Removing the drums results in an elegant production, and I took the opportunity to lower some of the mid-range (750 - 1250Hz) frequencies in the guitar track so it blends better with Will's ZynAddSubFX synth.

Version with percussion:
In an effort to better integrate the drums, there is now less (shorter duration) reverb on both the drums and guitar, and the over-all level of the drums is cut by about 15%. Also, the above mentioned mid-range cut is applied to the guitar.

I just need time to EQ the files for MP3 - then I'll post them both here so they can be compared with the original. Thanks to everyone who contributed recommendations; that is the true value of this forum.
« Last Edit: September 14, 2008, 08:08:28 AM by Oren » Logged

kara
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« Reply #13 on: September 14, 2008, 08:02:49 AM »

Looking forward to this  Cool

k
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Wyatt
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« Reply #14 on: September 14, 2008, 01:18:15 PM »

I am looking forward to these too.

This song made a space for itself in my ears,
and then just moved in and made itself at home.     Grin

Question:  Did you add the drums afterwards, or
did the song start out in the beginning with the
drum track?

Glad you've persevered; this one is worth it.

Cool

Wyatt

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