Hanging on other peoples coat-tails (again)

[folderol]

Last month I was particularly taken by the acoustic guitar track submitted by Patrick9 - although I wasn't so keen on what he added later!

However, as he'd supplied the raw track I decided to have a play with it myself. I added a quiet rhythm guitar, synth lines and a bass.

So here is my arrangement of Patrick's tune.

[kara]

A good track 
That subtle rhythmic guitar in the right channel is a great idea.
To make it a full song, it would need vocals I think 


k

PS : Did you notice that it clips in some spots ?

[MarioD]

All I can say is WOW

You have put the finishing touches on a masterpiece 

EXCELLENT 

[Oren]

I added a quiet rhythm guitar, synth lines and a bass.
So here is my arrangement of Patrick's tune.

Excellent compliments to an inspired acoustic guitar performance.

[folderol]

Thank you people. I was so enchanted by Patrick's simple melody I was determined to just support it as gently as possible.

@kara
There's no clipping showing in Audacity of either the raw tracks or the overall mix.
A problem I have is that my neck pickup seems to be microphonic, and I tend to get clicks from it. Unfortunately my most comfortable strumming position is right above it. At first I thought I was actually hitting the pickup with the pick, but it's not that. It is actually picking up the acoustic sound of the pick hitting the next string. Seems to be more noticeable on the down stroke when the pick is flatter to the string as it hits it.

What I'm thinking of doing is trying to make another recording but keeping away from that position. I hope I can do this without having to concentrate so hard I end up loosing the feel of the song.

P.S.
If any of you resident guitarists can suggest a way round this I'd be grateful.

[offthewall]

 
First .... this is a wonderful piece. Beautifully crafted. (I bet you didn't know that Pat is from my home town and we used to play the same club 40 years ago) 

Anyway ... that's another story.

As for your guitar pick-up problem.
I have found that the idiosyncrasy which you describe is actually one of the attributes which gives the Telecaster it's unique sound.
However, if this is a problem to you, you can try this quite simple adjustment.
If you remove the several small screws from the scratch-plate (I really don't know why they made it like this  ) and slide the plate out from under the strings, you should reveal the adjustment screws for the pick-up.  Just set it 'down' by a few turns each side.  That may relieve your problem.  Obviously you can test and re-set as often as is needed before replacing the scratch-plate.
There is a fine balance between the relative heights of the pick-ups and the tonal balance. Little harm can come from experimentation, young sir!   

 
James

[kara]

@kara
There's no clipping showing in Audacity of either the raw tracks or the overall mix.

Strange....
Look at the screenshot attached from Audacity of your downloaded track

k

[folderol]

@james
Thanks for your comments. Thanks also for the pickup suggestion. I'll give it a try as soon as I can find some of that mythical quantity called 'spare time'

@kara
Indeed strange. I get a very different pattern here. Doing a clipping check over the entire track I get exactly three peaks of 0dB. I did this check with the original wav. When checking the ogg file I see none at all.

I'm using audacity version 1.3.12-beta (as supplied with debian squeeze)

P.S.
Checking my notes, on the final mix I used a -3db fast look-ahead limiter followed by amplify to 0dB.

[kara]

@kara
Indeed strange. I get a very different pattern here. Doing a clipping check over the entire track I get exactly three peaks of 0dB. I did this check with the original wav. When checking the ogg file I see none at all.

I'm using audacity version 1.3.12-beta (as supplied with debian squeeze)

P.S.
Checking my notes, on the final mix I used a -3db fast look-ahead limiter followed by amplify to 0dB.

Indeed very strange, I use the same version on MAC
Look at the attached detail screenshot, it's clear it clips ?

How can that be, an OGG file can't change by sending it over the internet 

Perhaps Oren, our audio master can explain it ?

[offthewall]

Just for curiosity I dropped into my Audacity 1.3beta and had a look.
There is an option under 'Analyze' called 'find clipping'.
When I processed this it showed 2 instances of '3 of 0'

Make of that what you will.

 
James

[folderol]

Curiouser and curiouser!

Putting on my thinking cap... three people with the same file and essentially the same software but all different results, so what is different?

Well, I'm using Linux, Rony is using a Mac and James is using Windows. That looks pretty significant to me

... and I bet the significance is in the (almost certainly) different underlying math libraries. Now if Oren gets the same result as me with his Linux setup and someone on Windows gets the same as James that would put the tin hat on it.

Maybe in future I should work to -0.5dB. It won't make much difference to the sound but hopefully would eliminate these anomalies.

@James
Missed that bit about Pat. Did you ever meet all those years ago?

[offthewall]

@James
Missed that bit about Pat. Did you ever meet all those years ago?

It's a bit of a long story ... but Quite Interesting ... as they say 

Not long after I started to contribute over at KVR there was a theme where we had to make a composition in the style of another artist. I jumped straight in, using the premise that I can't sing/ write unintelligible lyrics / and don't play all that well, so did a song in the style of Dylan.  Patrick9 went one better and did a song called Canny Lad in the style of 'ME'.  I was a bit taken aback at this. Not long after that he posted a song in the 'Cafe' as a sort of audio tribute to the river Tyne. I instantly recognised various references in that piece so I P.M'ed him about his connections.  In further correspondences it transpired that we are both from the same town (where I still live) and that he still comes to visit his elderly parents up here.
Now knowing him as Patrick S****s we write to each other from time to time and do a couple of collabs together, one being submitted as 'Geordie Girls'. We even tried a couple of times to meet up but, at the time I was going through all that medical stuff with my late father so it didn't work out.
Then, about a year ago, one of the monthly themes was 'to make a song in the style of a deceased musical hero'.  I submitted a song in the style of Jim Croce.  Pat posted a song in the style of Buddy Holly and included a photograph of this young BH look-a-like.  As soon as I saw that picture I recognised Paddy N****n who used to play on the same stage with me in the late 60's.  I wrote to Pat and said ... is this you?   Of course it was!!
I didn't ask why he now has a different name. That is none of my business.

At that time, he was a young singer doing mainly traditional folk songs with guitar accompaniment. I was a 'rebellious' blues guitarist.  I could write page after page on the conflict which was going on, then, trying to get blues music accepted into the folk clubs.  Suffice to say that the club where we both performed together was actually the first, and best, Folk and Blues Club in the north of England. I was on the committee of that club for many years and Paddy was quite a part of it.
Since we discovered this common past we have never actually met up ... yet !!

   You DID ask 

 
James

[Oren]

Maybe in future I should work to -0.5dB. It won't make much difference to the sound but hopefully would eliminate these anomalies.

The recommended maximum (to prevent clipping in all playback software) is -0.25 dB. I go one step further and limit all my audio files to -1.0 dB. With all the clean headroom available in digital audio, it seems pointless to push the levels too close to the 0 dB mark.

When set to "show clipping", Audacity in Puredyne gives us six instances in Will's Ogg Vorbis file...

[kara]

When set to "show clipping", Audacity in Puredyne gives us six instances in Will's Ogg Vorbis file...

At least we have the same result

k

[magmavander]

Well, clipping or not clipping, that is the question 

Wonderfuly peaceful piece, a touch of nostalgia, simple and strong.
Should be used in a wim wender's road movie 

thanks!!


mag