Kara-Moon Forum

well, still not sure if that's the way to post this onhere  :-\

thanks to Oren for the invite to this community and for editing/mastering this opus
cheers from the West Coast,
Étienne

Hi Etienne

Welcome here !
It certainly has a good groove and it builds up nicely.
For my personnal taste the buildup is to slow, but that's just my taste, I know that it's a typical club mix.

All in all, it's a good production.
A bit to long to my taste, but I guess that's the standard now for that type of music.

k

Hi Etienne,

Nice to have you here. 8) I concur with Kara...a stone groove...makes you want to freaky-deaky! O0 I'm aware that this is the standard length for club music,but I think something more musical than just a beat & rhythmic sounds would make those 7 minutes pass more interestingly.
I think a simple bass line,as well as a riff & some chords in certain segments would really bring a lot of impact to this piece.At least for me anyway,to have some melodies in dance music is something that really stirs me up...something that would stick in my head.

Melodic dance music is so distinctive,as it provides a powerful emotional impact that you can't forget.Back in the day,one of my favorite club bands was New Order,as not only could you could dance your butt off to it to no end,but you could really zone out & relax to it as well...it was really a great escape.

As good as this piece is & in as much as I like it,I think it's still  just a foundation for something more,but I am speaking from my personal pallet.


-Thom

Good to see you in action here, Etienne :-
There are folks here who know the genre, and will provide all kinds of suggestions for possible improvements.
My only observation: We should have made it LOUDER :D

P.S....The original composition is actually 3 minutes longer than presented here, comprised of an extended introduction. In order to fit within the 8mb file size limit, we shortened the file. Etienne felt the ogg vorbis compression sounded better, so he posted only that, and not the MP3 version.

oh my my my Oren, LOUDER would be GREAT
Thom, I tried (for countless hours) to insert a trumpet solo inhere but had to scratch that idea  :'(  it just sounded terrible. If you are inspired to synth up a sax (or chords  ??? ), I'd be pleased to hear what you come up with. Thank you for your elaborate feedback. New Order is a huge influence, alongside Depeche Mode of course, and NIN. I too long for the melodic that I loved so much in the trip hop era (Portishead, Lamb and Tricky).
Kara, indeed it is a current trend in electronic music and you are right: it is a club mix! and also a submission to a remix contest for Steve Lawler's record label Viva Mus!c. Such a production requires an intro and outro that a Dj will be able to use for mixing one track into the next.

In the studio today to tweak around like a mad man  >:D and will post a new version shortly
This site rocks! Thank you  ;D

ATN,

I'd be happy to integrate with your groove,but I was wondering if you would be willing to send me all of your tracks individually in WAV or OGG format via YouSendIt?
That's the way we work it here,in order to maintain high fidelity & a balanced mix.However,if your not comfortable doing it that way,I'll just work with your MP3.....just let me know & I'll post my e-mail here.

-Thom

Much happier with this new version (clocking at 8 minutes)

---

it has a different intro and an edit of the chorus to glide with the slight build up
I also have improved the transition to the vocals and brought back the drum machine at the end
you guys are the first to hear the progress [had to be .ogg again]
very fine tuning (on EQ and compressors) will have to wait til later
Étienne 2:22 am
crank the volume up!  8)

thanks again Thom,
the newbie feels a tad daunted by the task... I'd need another session with Oren to figure out how to do that. I am not familiar with YSI and in the software I use (Ableton Live) there are currently 24 files, each with lots of clips...
I'll be sure to educate myself about the best ways of sharing for the sake of collaboration, but since I am pressed with time (there is a deadline for this contest) maybe you can apply a teaser of what you hear "over" the tune instead on "inside" it this time around.

Etienne,
Nice job of the new mix, editing, and a schweet Ogg Vorbis production :-

Thom,
If you could work with a 16/44.1 wave file of the original mix, I'll yousendit your way...

Etienne,

I like the bass line quite a bit,as it fits like a glove. 8) However though,I found the bass line to be a bit weak & overpowered by the bass drum.
I'd like to suggest that you back off of the bass drum a bit & bring up the bass a tad more.Judging by this mix,I'm guessing that your monitors or headphones,are too bright in the mid-range and lacking in the low end...which typically occur with 5" studio monitors,particularly with the KRK Rokit series.

Since Oren stepped in and offered me your WAV files,I'll get cracking on those when I recieve them from him. 8)


-Thom

By the way Etienne,we're all here at your disposal...for any assistance you may need with file sharing,recording techniques,gear advice...whatever...always glad to help break in newbies.

Just 3 years ago,I was exactly in the same spot you're in now and these fine cats here,whipped me into shape in no time flat! :o 8)


-Thom

Intr'stin'

I wasn't too keen on the first version but that bass line really adds a new dimension. Still not really my 'thing' but good work anyway 8)

simply blows my mind  :o that one can train their own ears to such a fine degree as to hear the EQing of a bass line
let's see if I can correct this (I believe toying with compressors might just do the trick)
Thanks a whole lot

Welcome ATN to the forums.

I am not an expert in this genre however I do believe that the bass should be a lot louder, i.e more kick*ss!  But that could be just me.

Would you mind if I put some guitar leads in it?

Very good work here – I’m impressed!

Yes it will. Use a side chain compressor on the kick and feed it with the bass. It will 'duck' the kick when the bass plays

k

Etienne,

On the contrary,I was actually referring to the "EQ-ing" of powered speakers...meaning that people who-for instance,use studio monitors such as the KRK Rokits(particularly the ones with the 5 inch bass cone)...these speakers do not provide enough bass and output too much of the higher frequencies.
As a result of this,one tends to overcompensate for what they cannot hear,by boosting the volume and/or EQ settings to a level that sounds balanced on said monitors-when in fact,the recording actually has an overabundance of bass,of which you can hear clearly on other systems.

I myself don't mess with compression much-as I'm no expert,but I agree with what Kara mentioned.


-Thom

Etienne,

I tried to line up your WAV file that Oren sent me with my metronome in my Presonus DAW,but could not.If you could give me the tempo & time signature info,that would be great.


Thanks,

-Thom

oh my  :o I didn't know about "ducking" so much to learn!!! thank you all for feedback and comments, they served me well and will certainly continue to effect future musical endeavours
  8) you guys rock
there will be more of me onhere  ;D
I have posted my final version here   http://steve-lawler-remix.heroku.com/965 (http://steve-lawler-remix.heroku.com/965)   open for VOTING!  :-
Étienne aka sATNam

Etienne,

Your new mix is spot on,as it's very well balanced. 8) I like that you've extended the bass line,because it is the heart of the tune,now.

As for rendering my own take on this mix..well...when you told me that you combined two different tempos(120 & 124),I knew I was in trouble! :-[ I changed the tempo in my DAW from 120 to 124 and I even messed around with different time signatures,but I just could not get anything to align properly.
It's superb in composition and you did a fantastic job on it,but if someone put a gun to my head-I'd be dead,as I'll never be able to sync up to it.I'm sorry,but I had to back out of this,as it's just beyond my capabilities.

Your latest version stands well as it is and for strictly a club tune,it's perfect...but if at some point you decide to add more musical elements to it-your the man for this job, as you possess the talent to pull it off on your own. 8)

I'm sure there will be something in the future that we can collaborate on,as I have merged with just about everyone on this forum.


-Thom

Now, that's a production! Improved in every way - crisp, punchy, and with enough variety to capture and hold the listener's attention.

(listen to Thom - he's some kind of natural frickin' wizard... :D)

Here's a chance for Thom to have a go at this. A definite 124bpm. Extra percussion from Hydrogen. Lawler's tracks remixed.

...I'm hoping for a large butt-kicking bass line, Thom, so I can apply some electrical guitar later... but do what moves you...
...if you want big files to work with, they're yours... ;D

Gimme dem phat files,so that I may get my groove on proper! O0

Thanks Oren,


-Thom

Well....here's my take on the club funk...Elwood-style. 8) Those friggin' Hydrogen drums lacked quite a bit of punch & depth,so I did the best I could with them.
All that work that I put into Oren's drum track,has spawned some ideas for me to go in another direction & eventually come up with yet another version of this Slawler theme.

I hope this works for you Oren....let me know what else you may need.


-Thom

This is how collabs uniquely work here :;

Beautiful! :;

(Hydrogen is as deep as the programmer chooses to make it. I have a lot to learn... ;))

Thanks for the very spirited comment Will! 8)

@Oren........a little compression & some EQ can go a long way,but based on my experiences with drum samples,the meat of the sound is squarely based on the level of work that goes into recording a sample.
I have no idea of Hydrogen's potential,but I have noticed that some of my drum kits in my most recent Presonus update,have the most impressive sample quality-right out of the gate...which surpasses most everything else in my studio's drum sound arsenal(of which negates the need for any polishing).


-Thom

I agree with Will :-

Great job gentlemen  :;

Thank you Sir! 8)


-Thom

I hear you, Thom. I'll work on that. O0
Improved impact in Hydrogen is achieved by either layer existing sounds, importing samples and making your own "drumkit", or recording your own samples.
For now, compression and EQ on the percussion track is a good place to start.