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Author Topic: Looking for a mic...  (Read 13659 times)
Moon
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« on: December 22, 2007, 10:34:13 AM »

I'm looking for a mic for doing some vocal recordings in my studio.

There are so many mics in different price ranges. I'v got pretty good mic preamps in my Yamaha 01X and I88x. What should I be looking for. Any recommendations ?

P.S.: I'm not looking for the perfect mic, but for a mic with superb price/performance ratio.
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Wyatt
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« Reply #1 on: December 22, 2007, 11:34:13 AM »

Hi Moon,

Anyway, I have mic that is still serving me very well, is very versatile,  and didn't cost me a fortune.

Surprise..it isn't a Shure SM 57..(which might also be a very good choice)..it is a Shure PG58..cardioid dynamic vocal mic..I paid $59 US for it.

It is a good vocal mic, and since the pickup pattern is 6", it does well even if you haven't got a sound-tuned room.

I use it with a fluff-muff for vocals, and without one for acoustic guitar.

I have gotten some lovely acoustic guitar and harrmonica recordings with it, and though the mic placement was different than I would have expected, once I got that dialed in, I got surprisingly good results.

I have also used it to mic my electric guitar amp..I have gotten some real good sound by mic'ing one track and running the second track direct to the mixer from the amp..the two together sound awesome.

So I have found it to be versatile, and since owning this mic, I have demo'ed two different condensor mics that I eventually returned, because they didn't begin to sound as good as this relatively cheap mic. I have been very happy with this mic; it has saved me a lot of money because I didn't have to keep going out buying "better" ones.  Grin

Wyatt
« Last Edit: December 24, 2007, 08:57:55 AM by Wyatt » Logged

kara
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« Reply #2 on: December 22, 2007, 12:10:54 PM »

Don't hesitate Moon : Studioproject B1
http://www.zzounds.com/item--STUB1

You heard the result on the In a spin CD Smiley

k
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rharv
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« Reply #3 on: December 22, 2007, 12:29:43 PM »

Do you have other mics?
 If not, the first mic I'd recommend is the SM57. Everyone should have one simply because it can do everything; very utilitarian(ever heard the song with everything recorded using only SM57's ?).

 Vocals; I know many people have their personal preferences. For me doing when backups I again like the SM57 (I just roll the bottom out with EQ).
Many people like the LDC's because they catch every breath, lip-smack, etc.  Need phantom power usually. I like these also for lead vocals. Good deal IMO is Behringer B1 or B2. Some people like the MXL's, and I've heard decent recordings with them, just never used one personally and know a couple people that returned theirs because they didn't like the sound.
 Many many singers like their SM58, many of them grew up using it and developed their singing all along using one.  Our vocalist Barry is this way for all his rock vocals (but he will use the B1 for ballads, etc.).
 Audix OM5 has been preferred
So has the Rode NT1.
These are all mics I've recorded with (not all mine; some brought in by artists)
Also have used AKG C1000  and C2000B  with good results.
The 1000 seemed to pick up a lot of room noise where I was using them, could have been the location though, as it wasn't in a studio, it was on location in a building that was converted to a church.
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Martin E
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« Reply #4 on: December 22, 2007, 12:56:01 PM »

I use a Rode Nt1a ( about 190 euro) for recording acoustic guitars with very good results. And I use a AKG perception 200 ( now about 145 euro) for all my vocal recordings. These two mics are both condenser mics so they will pick up a lot of background sound. I usually record as close as possible to the mic and use a gate to get rid of the background noises. You can listen to my vocal recordings in my mixthread. I used to use a AKG C1000 but I think that one is not as good as the two mentioned above. I also have the Shure sm57 (somewhere) but personally I wouldn't use a dynamic mic to record vocals in a studio environment especially because of the low impedance.

Of equal importance of course is the room your going to record in. It will have an effect on the sound of the recording as well. The room I record in is practically dry with hardly any room reflections. It's in the attic of my house with carpet on the floor and blankets and curtains and lots of other stuff to dampen the sound  Grin A full camping kit to be precise, ha ha.
« Last Edit: December 22, 2007, 05:04:36 PM by Martin E » Logged
Oren
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« Reply #5 on: December 22, 2007, 01:42:02 PM »

Well, folks...

Because I live in North America, I use a Shure mic, but if I lived in Europe I'd try and find the equivalent AKG.

My model PE56D is basically the SM58 with a switch. My model PE54D is basically a SM57 with a switch.
Tough, reliable tools, with very predictable performance. Whatever characteristics they lack for a particular job can usually be compensated for by the pre-amp, EQ, and placement.

I've used these two mics exclusively since 1981, both on stage and in various recording situations, and they show absolutely no sign of deterioration. That's a lot of beer, spit, cigarette smoke, rain, and rough handling over 26 years.

The down side is, that if I don't sound good, I can't blame it on the microphone... Cry

Oren.
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Wyatt
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« Reply #6 on: December 22, 2007, 04:56:15 PM »

..yep, I knew that sm 57 would be coming up..super mic for *versatility*, and I have seen them used a lot for mic'ing drum kits. I never used one for vocals, but Mac likes them, and Mac knows pretty much everything..

When I tested one in the store with my harp, it really wasn't that good for harp, which is why I didn't buy it..which brings up another point:

There is no substitute for your own ears.

Yes, it was easy for me to try out my harp in the store..my truck won't start unless there's a harp in the glove-box!

If at all possible, arrange to try out mics in your own recording environment..that is the way you really know what is right for you, your room, and your usage.

I have demo'ed a lot of stuff, and finally have a world class perfect harp mic as a result....and as you might imagine, I have done a lot of business with the folks who were that helpful..most business people will see the benefits of making a regular customer out of you.

Wyatt

PS..and if you don't have a store near you, there is another way to do it.
« Last Edit: December 22, 2007, 05:21:38 PM by Wyatt » Logged

Oren
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« Reply #7 on: December 23, 2007, 10:09:49 AM »

Wyatt,

I don't play the harp, so my mic preferences have no validity in that area.

Last session, however, Tom Eberhardt had my guitar across his knees, "fretting" it with a small bottle. He grabbed a harpoon from his collection and handed it to me, and I played it into my SM58(PE56D) with an extra foam cover in place. Seemed to work fine - but then...I don't play harmonica Cheesy

I'm wondering if that PG58 isn't tonally similar to a SM58? I generally use the 58 much more than the 57, although I never have to mic drums or guitar amps.

Oren.
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Wyatt
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« Reply #8 on: December 23, 2007, 01:14:18 PM »

Oren,

I was thinking last night..the sound quality on your vocals has always spoken highly of your choice of vocal mic.

..as for harp, you're doin' jes fine.  Grin

Wyatt

..all I need is to get my computer out of the hospital so I can record a new song.

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Oren
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« Reply #9 on: December 23, 2007, 02:26:56 PM »

Sent it in for a tune-up....or something more serious Cry?
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Moon
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« Reply #10 on: December 23, 2007, 03:48:44 PM »

Looks like we have a shortlist:
- Shure SM58 (115 euro with stand & cable)
- Studioproject B1 (112 euro)
- Rode NT1 (175 euro)

Further things one should know?

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Wyatt
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« Reply #11 on: December 23, 2007, 03:59:58 PM »

Sent it in for a tune-up....or something more serious Cry?

Seriousity, bro..the display all of a sudden washed out..I did a ton of stuff to try to remedy it..no go.

The tech-shop fellas figured that the on-board video was going..so they put a video card in the pci-X slot. The I get it home and the sound is dirty..static..very faint..then accumulating to a wipe out wave. Every player ..same story..worked with soundcard settings and everything was "normal"

..so I do a bunch of stuff: ..isolating cables, testing different speakers, checking for irq conflicts, and even removing the EMU 1212M altogether and doing a Virgin Re-Install on it.

So back to the shop..they got it better they said, but when I got there They were only set up to listen to one channel at a time, and the ambient noise in the room was monstrous..one ch at a time did sound improved, but when I got it home and listened to both channels, in my soundproof studio, it still had static..static that happens at different times..like 13-15 seconds is horrid one listen and pristine the next.

Then, I was planning to work on this dog over the weekend, but I started getting black screen of death repeatedly..so now I am sure enough that the video card is not happy, in spite of the dire consequences that I offered it if it didn't straighten up.  Smiley

I had updated all drivers, optimized my dual core chip..un-optimized my dual core chip..oh yeah..I also did a system restore early on.

This mysteriosity, coupled with the strange behaviour of my secondary HD a few short weeks ago, is making me suspicious of my mobo..I am thinking the mobo is seriously running short of mojo.

<Sigh> ..and I had some recording I wanted to do on several fronts, as well as some grahics work, and a new web site to code.

Oh well, it has been a lot of years since I could actually get anything accomplished the last half of December..I still try..silly me.  Grin

Wyatt
« Last Edit: December 23, 2007, 04:03:42 PM by Wyatt » Logged

kara
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« Reply #12 on: December 23, 2007, 04:24:26 PM »

Good choice I think

k

Looks like we have a shortlist:
- Shure SM58 (115 euro with stand & cable)
- Studioproject B1 (112 euro)
- Rode NT1 (175 euro)

Further things one should know?


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« Reply #13 on: January 12, 2008, 04:30:26 AM »

It's been a little while since this thread was started so I dont know if you found yourself a mic yet, but I'm kinda into microphones and have tried/own alot of them so I'll  throw a few recommendations out if you want.

The first thing to understand is that no matter how much or little the mic costs it may not be the correct one for a particular voice. You really should try out any mic before you buy it to see if it works with your voice. Especially most of the cheaper condensers as they are mostly made in China and can vary quite a bit due to quality control issues.

Secondly, you have to keep in mind what your goals are for the mic. You've said that you want to do vocal recording so I'm going to proceed with that in mind.


Shure SM57/58 - these are great mics and very versatile. The SM57 is the de facto standard mic for guitar cabinets and very popular for snares also. It's a versatile mic that will do a respectable job on alot of different sources, but will rarely be spectacular. (excepting cabs and snare) It's a good value and is the type of mic that you will probably keep even after you get better ones. If you are sure you are only going to be doing vocals it's not what I would recommend first though as it's not one of it's stronger points(Unless you're screaming). The 57 and 58 are essentially the same mic. If you unscrew the ball end off of a 58 it's almost identical to a 57. The 58 is generally considered more of a stage mic while the 57 is very common both onstage and in the studio. An added bonus to these mics is that they are almost indestructible.

Studio Projects B1 - This is generally regarded as one of the better entry level condensers. It's a solid mic for very little money. I have used one a decent amount and it is quite good on acoustic guitars and other acoustic strings. It's pretty neutral sounding to my ears and doesn't impart a lot of character. Because of that it would not be something I would reach for when tracking vocals, but I wouldn't consider it a great hindrance if it was all I had to use either.

Rode NT1A - This is another popular low cost mic. It's a little more expensive than the SP B1, but it is more detailed also. Rode as a company has a pretty solid reputation and some of the more expensive mics in their line are quite well regarded. The NT1A has very low self noise. I think it's probably the quietest mic of all the budget condensers that I have used. Some people really like this mic for vocals ( I see that  Martin uses it), but for my voice it didn't work so well. One thing to consider about this mic is that it is very bright. That can either be a good thing or a bad thing depending on the vocalist. If you tend toward sibilance in your singing (as I do) that's a bad thing. I did get some good acoustic tracks with it though.

CAD M179 - This is another low cost condenser. This mic is solid for vocals and is extremely versatile due to the fact that it has a switch on it that allows you continuously vary the polar pattern from tight  cardiod to omni. It isnt particularly brilliant on anything, but it sucks on nothing. All in all this is a very cool mic.

MXL V67g - This mic is kind of silly looking with it's green paint job and gold grill, but despite that and it's fairly cheap price tag, it works really well on some types of vocals. This is not an overly bright mic at all. It's a little hyped in the mid frequency area which can make a vocal sound very big, but also makes it a little less useful for other applications IMO. I do not like it on acoustic guitar at all as it is far too boomy.

Oktava MK-319 - This is a Russian condenser mic. It's pretty dark sounding in comparison to the other mics listed so far. That can sound dull to some people, but it's really just that it does not have an artificial bump in the highs like most cheaper condensers. It can sound good on some vocalists. Especially women and high pitched male voices. This mic can be modded into a much nicer mic for fairly little money after the fact also.

MXL V69m -  This is a slightly more expensive mic than most of the others I've posted, but I thought it worth a mention as it is one I use for my own vocals quite a bit. This mic has relatively high self noise, but nothing which would make it unusable. It is definitely not a neutral sounding mic and imparts it's own color to everything you record with it. It's sort of smokey sounding in a good way. Similar to the V67g, but supercharged. It's one of my favorites.

Shure SM7b - This is another dynamic mic from Shure, but a nicer one. This mic is also a little more expensive than some of the others here, but it's definitely worth it. They are easy to find used though (around $300)and they are pretty rugged. I tend to use this when I'm singing a more aggressive/fast rock song. It's never failed me and between it and the V69 it's about all I use on my own voice anymore. One thing to be aware of with this microphone though is that it needs a lot of clean gain from your preamp to get the best out of it. It's also a mic that I find shows an especially big difference from preamp to preamp. Highly recommended.



I've listed mostly condensers here as there are alot more good cheap options for them than dynamics for vocals, but don't be mislead by that. There are plenty of really good dynamic vocal mics for studio use. They just tend to be in the next price range up. (Sm7, RE20, etc) Still they are not as expensive as really nice condensers either though. Condenser tend to have higher outputs so because of that they are going to pick up a lot more ambient sound than a dynamic. This can make a dynamic a good option if you are in a bad sounding room or a noisey environment. Anyway, I hope this helps at least a little if you haven't already gotten a mic. Smiley
« Last Edit: January 12, 2008, 07:41:49 PM by Van Greco » Logged
kara
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« Reply #14 on: January 12, 2008, 09:08:40 AM »

A great overview VG, thank you for your input
Quote
Studio Projects B1 - This is generally regarded as one of the better entry level condensers. It's a solid mic for very little money. I have used one a decent amount and it is quite good on acoustic guitars and other acoustic strings. It's pretty neutral sounding to my ears and doesn't impart a lot of character. Because of that it would not be something I would reach for when tracking vocals, but I wouldn't consider it a great hindrance if it was all I had to use either.

Depends on the voice I think....
I use it to record the ladies vox and achieve pretty good result with it, together with the vtb pre-amp

k

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